Matt Slick Live

The following program is recorded content created by the Truth Network. It's Matt Slick Live. Matt is the founder and president of the Christian Apologetics Research Ministry, found online at calm. dot org. When you have questions about Bible doctrines, turn to Matt Slick Live for answers.

Taking your calls and responding to your questions at eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six. Here's Matt Slick. Everybody, welcome to the show. It's me, Matt Slick, and you're listening to Matt Slick Live. Today's date is November tenth, twenty twenty-six.

Hope it's a good day for you. I am hanging in there, and I've got a persistent cough, getting over pneumonia.

So please be bear with me with that, and.

Sorry about that, but hey, look. If you want to give me a call, as usual, all you got to do is dial eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six and give me a call. I want to hear from you. Give me a call; it's easy, and we can talk.

Now, you can also send an email to info at carm dot org. Info at c a r m dot o r g. Put the subject line, radio comment or radio question, and we can then get to it. All right, all right. Or one of them.

Of course, I'll do is I'll get that going here because we have no calls coming in at the moment, which is fine. I do want to let you all know. Excuse me.

Sorry. I'm going to try this cough button. I don't know if that helps or not. You can hear me. But I'm still dealing with this.

It's okay, you know, getting over pneumonia, and so I'm fine until I start talking, and then I start coughing because of it. That's just how it goes. All right.

So I'm going to hear from you. Give me a call, and we can talk about whatever you want to talk about: Mormonism, Jehovah's Witnesses, Christian Science, Unity, Bahá'í, Islam, Roman Catholicism, Eastern Orthodoxy, UFOs, the occult, various things. I've been studying for a long time.

Now, so, all right. One of the things that we're doing on on the Karm site is we're advancing tech quite a bit. We have some new stuff coming on, and we're going to be moving into a new school system and things like that. But in the meantime. I've begun working on a new school.

Now I've written a school on theology, a school on apologetics, a school on critical thinking, and I'm going to write and I've already started researching and arranging topics and order and things like this for a school on interpreting the Bible called hermeneutics. And what I'm going to be doing is producing 25 to 35 lessons on this, bit by bit, going through a lot of issues of the scriptures, so that you, if you're interested, can sign up, and we use it to help support the ministry, and and you can learn how to interpret Scripture better and easier. I'm going to be using all kinds of examples of things that will. Hopefully, bring people to better understanding of theology as well as better understanding of just how to read Scripture, and it's an involved thing to learn how to interpret Scripture. And you can do it quickly, you can do it easily, but you can also do it at different levels.

And one of the things that I'm having to deal with is talking to the Jovis—not the Jovis, excuse me—the Eastern Orthodox Roman Catholics. Because what they like to do is say that their church has the authority to interpret Scripture.

Now, I always ask them, "How do you know that's true?" and "How do you interpret whatever it is you are told to believe that that is true?" and then they're stuck. But I was working on an article: who has the ability to interpret Scripture? And I would say, anybody who reads it is as simple as that.

Now, what do you do when there's differences of opinion?

Well, then you have to do hermeneutics. You got to do some serious study.

Now, we have an example of something. I was in a debate a few weeks ago. It was with the Church of Christ, gentlemen, A.K. Richardson, and hold on, I gotta clear my throat again.

Sorry about that. And we're discussing the issue of election. Does God choose people for salvation? And of course, He and others will say, "No, it's not true." Well, you know, I go to Second Thessalonians two thirteen, which says God chooses us from the beginning for salvation. But what I've done in more and more discussions is go to three main verses.

Now, I am going to use this as an example of something. In um, in John, that's right. I'm gonna do this right here. I forgot to put this in. Did I do that?

Yeah, I did. No, everything's good. In John six sixty five, Jesus says, "You cannot come to me unless it has been granted to you from the Father." Now Jesus says, "You cannot come to me unless it's been granted to you from the Father." So, how do you interpret that?

Well, you interpret it very simply. You you understand it to mean that you can't come to Christ unless God the Father grants it to you. That's what you do. It's not hard to do that. And what a lot of people do is they'll say, "No, it's up to my free will," and immediately they contradict Scripture.

So, for example, when Jesus says in John six sixty five, "You cannot come to me unless it has been granted to you from the Father," then what it means is you cannot come to Christ unless God the Father grants it to you. People will say, "I'm going to reiterate, it's up to my free will, my free will, me, me, me." And what what I'll often do is, hold on, I'm hearing some stuff.

So, there we go.

So what I'll do is I'll.

Okay, hold on. I can hear you. I can hear you, Laura.

So I can hear you through another speaker microphone system.

So when I bring this up to people, and they they hear what I'm saying, and they want to raise their free will issue, I have to repeat the scripture to them over and over and over again to try and get them to submit to God's word. The reason I bring this up is because people will often have an idea is based in their feelings, their sensibilities, and they submit God's word to that sensibility, to that feeling. And this is one of the ways to demonstrate that this is just not true. You can't come to Christ unless it's been granted by the Father. And Jesus says that the work of God is that you believe, John six twenty nine.

The reason you believe is because God works it in you to believe. This is the word of God that you believe in Him whom He has sent. John six twenty nine, and Philippians one twenty nine. It says clearly, clearly, that that it's God in the context who grants that you have faith. And so these three verses, John six sixty five, John six twenty nine, Philippians one twenty nine.

What they do is that it's a trifecta, a tripod of understanding. That there are certain things the Bible clearly says that people don't like, including Protestants and Christians and people who don't like some of these things. When I bring these things up to them and show them this is what the Scriptures are teaching, I get a lot of pushback because they have their feelings. They have their sensibilities. They've been misled, unfortunately, by their their pastors and their churches over the years, who say it's up to you and your free will.

Well, where's it say that in the Bible? The Bible speaks to the contrary of it. And then they don't like that, and they get into these ramifications. We have discussions, but the point I'm trying to make is, what does the Scripture say? Are you submitting to it?

This is one of the issues of hermeneutics. Not only do you have to understand what it it says, are you going to submit to what it says? A lot of Christians don't want to do that because a lot of Christians are misled. A lot of Christians are are taught improper biblical theology from the pulpit. You know, I went to a local Calvary Chapel.

A topic we could talk about: Calvary Chapel's movement towards heresy.

Now. But hold on. I went to a Calvary Chapel, and a few months ago. Hold on, my please excuse me for the cough. I hit the cough button, but still coughing.

Getting over pneumonia, folks. That's why.

So, like I said, I went to this Calvary Chapel. A few months ago, and the pastor was going to discuss the issue of the three main views of eschatology—omnil, premill, postmill—and I thought, okay, it'd be interesting. How's he going to handle it? I know that they're premillennial, and that's fine. And the way he did this—and I brought it up before—is he brought up the omillennial position in such a way that it was condescending, insulting, and made people think that people who hold to it just aren't biblical and aren't sincere with the Word of God.

And I, I walk out. I'm done. I just, I'm out. You know, I'm not going to put up with that kind of, of lack of ability to properly define positions that are held by very competent believers, and not make it such that if you don't agree with what he says, then you're not a smart or a spiritual. This kind of arrogance is prevalent in theological perspectives all over the place.

Hermeneutics requires. That we submit our hearts and our minds to what the Word of God actually, actually says. It's not easy to do. I call people to do it all the time, and I'm not saying I do it perfectly, but it's just what it is. We need to assure ourselves and and others that we are at least attempting to understand the word of God properly, and not only understand it, but believe it and submit to what it actually says.

Let's get to Jermaine from California. Jermaine, welcome. You're on the air, brother. Hey, Matt. I um had a question for you about the Acts two versus the mid Acts.

Nine, I guess they would say dispensationalist position.

Now, a friend of mine that is heavily into the the mid Acts nine, they seem to divide the Bible starting at Acts nine, and there was supposed to be a one year gap period after Jesus was on the cross that they say Israel had an extra year of mercy, but I can't find that in the Bible. And I was wondering if you can provide some insight into that. I'm with you. It's not in the Bible. Midact dispensationalism.

I had some run-ins with some of those adherents a few years ago, and it was difficult to nail down what it was that they were believing. But excuse me. They. Oh, hold on, man.

Sorry about that. They they did just what you were saying, and was difficult to nail them down. To have them actually show things in scripture to actually say what they said, without implying things or reading into into their the scriptures that that the ideas and the theological perspectives that weren't true. If that makes sense.

Okay, and no need to. Go heavy into that because I, because I understand there is no, there is no one year period that I found that they've they've been able to present. But the other side of that is, you have many who insist that Paul writing to the Gentiles is all we need to listen to, and I really find that faulty. I realize that certain parts of Scripture may have not been written directly to us, but I I still see application. You know, as far as dividing the Bible correctly.

How I'm just I guess I'm kind of confused. How are they seeing this? Like, why would you think only certain parts of the Bible, in the New Testament exclusively, are for today's times for the what they call the body of Christ? Because they're whacked.

So what they'll do is they'll say that Pentecost didn't occur at Acts chapter two, but later with Paul the apostle, and so they heavily emphasize Paul the apostle's doctrines, which is why they want to, in a sense, trample the other stuff underfoot and dismiss it.

So that's what they do. I believe that they come to the scriptures with a preconceived idea that they think fits, and then they they find whatever they can to justify that.

So their problems with it, in that sometimes I've heard. I won't get into this too deeply, but I've heard some mid-Acts individuals talk about a gospel message or methodology different for different people at different dispensations.

Now, I can't verify that that's the the way that the mid-Acts people as a whole hold to, but that was one of the problems.

Now, there's only one gospel, and preaching another gospel is is to be cursed. You know, Acts. This could be Galatians one eight nine, and I've When I've encountered them, let me try to remember this. Excuse me.

We get back to the break. Clear my throat during the break, and then I'll get a little bit more.

So hold on, brother.

Okay. Hey folks, we'll be right back after these messages. Please, please stay tuned. We'll be right back. It's Matt Slick live.

Take your call at eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six. Here's Matt Slick. All right, buddy. Welcome back to the show. If you want to give me a call, we have two open lines: eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six.

Germaine, you still there? Yes, I am.

Okay, man, sorry about the coughing. Yeah, so the midax people. I don't have you. Have you recently encountered them, or you are just curious about them? I've actually had a long, I wouldn't say debate, but back and forth, well, pretty much a debate with a Christian brother of mine for about twelve years, and he gets deeper in this and.

What I do is something similar to your approach. I'll at least study some of their positions so I can thoroughly understand it. And the more I study, the more I just don't find what they're talking about in Scripture.

So, yeah, I just want to, you know, I don't. I've read all the materials. I've I've I've gone through hours of what they would call it advanced curriculum, and I still come away thinking reform. Teaching is is more accurate, so that's where I am so far. But I just really I'm perplexed how they can still divide the Bible up like pieces of pie in so many different sections and pieces that it it becomes confusing.

And I think some of them are confused, honestly. People sometimes will latch onto something that appeals to them that is nifty, new, different. They'll find a statement or two that excites them. They'll become identified with it, and then they start defending it. And so, this is, I believe, is the issue with the midacts people.

When I've encountered them, I have found them to be not very capable of exegesis without inserting into text what they wanted to say. And. There are different ways to deal with them, you know. They they teach that all the charismatic gifts have ceased, and use that as a pry bar against them, and go to First Corinthians twelve and fourteen, and say, well, then that means that large sections of Scripture no longer applicable to the church today. Is is that what you agree to?

And and so it's a backdoor way of getting in to undermine their their ideas, you know. And they'll say that the Gospels actually. And Hebrews are primarily to Israel, and that Paul's writings, Romans and Philippians, basically are are the writings for the church today. And if they're going to say that, then I say, well, then if he wrote these things and and Paul wrote to seek the spiritual gifts, how is it then that you who hold to Paul as the one who basically started the dispensational part where the church exists, he tells us to tackle and to seek the spiritual gifts, but you deny them?

So why the inconsistency? And this is one of the ways I found to to work against them, and it does it it it slows them down. Let's put it that way for some other issues. But yeah, okay, okay, sounds good. And before I go, I was wondering if you had heard about Calvary Chapel ordaining women as pastors.

You probably have to bring that up on another show, but I think this just Happened very recently. I was I was curious if you'd heard about that. Yes, I have, and they're moving into heresy. Chuck Smith would never have allowed this. The successor to him at Calvary Chapel Costa Mesa, which is where I used to go to church, is now ordaining women.

And this is this is bad. There's two groups: the Calvary Chapel, CCN, I believe, is network, and the other one is Global Network, CC GN. I think it is. I'm trying to remember. And one of them is retaining the issue of no women pastors and elders, where the former is affirming them.

And you know, if you've listened to me for any length of time, you know I stand against that wholeheartedly. Women are not to be pastors and elders because the scripture is clearly. Teach it. I heard a video I watched yesterday, believe it or not, on this very topic, and the exegetical butchering of God's word to support women pastors and elders was based on the priesthood of all believers, and this is just ludicrous. They couldn't extricate their way out of that paper bag, so I'll be writing about it, speaking about it, and I can no longer recommend Calvary Chapel as a church for people to go to.

So it's bad news. It is okay. Yeah, and I used to study their verse by verse studies back in the day, and I I can't find any scripture to support that either. But yeah, I'll let that go. I know you got other callers, man.

I appreciate you. Thank you. Amen. God bless, buddy. God bless.

God bless. All right.

Sorry, folks, for my coughing. I have a cough button. I've I try and implement it, but it doesn't seem to be hooked up properly. I'm getting over pneumonia, and it'll take another two to four weeks.

So it's been it's been a couple of two and a half weeks already. Let's get to Daniel from Northcare. I mean, New York. Excuse me, Daniel from New York. Welcome, brother.

You're on the air. Awesome, thank you so much, Matt. I called yesterday, and you said if I had any time to call back in today to continue our discussion about the Trinity, that that would be okay. Sure. One thing that I wanted to mention that I didn't get a chance to say yesterday is I asked if a visual representation of the Trinity.

Would be applicable to three concentric circles within a unified circle, and my my whole idea was that that might point to relativity within a unified whole. Does that make any sense whatsoever? Yes. Visual representations of the Trinity are always problematic. Any representation of the Trinity will be problematic.

I think that I've got one that is the least problematic. What I mean is not that it predicts or presents contradictions, but no analogy of what the infinite God is will be sufficient because it's just by definition an analogy. If you go with the idea of concentric circles. I really wouldn't do that, because. You could have different circles of different sizes.

What does that mean? If you have different size circles, does it mean then that the Father's bigger than the Son, or more power, more deity? Then you got to start working on things like that. And if you have a larger circle where the others are embedded inside of a circle, and the larger circle is the Father, then the implication can be that the Son and the Holy Spirit depend on on their existence. Inside the realm of the Father's existence, and we have problems with that.

So you see, that's why I don't use that. I use the analogy of time. People are are familiar with the idea of time, and I say time is one substance, one essence, one thing—just time. And yet, time is composed of past, present, and future. But yet, the past, present, and future are all by nature time.

Yet they're differentiated by their relation to one another. The past is yesterday. The present is now. The future is tomorrow. And so we see differentiation between their relations to each other.

Yet they retain the the same essence of divinity of time. And you carry that into. Issue of the Trinity, one God in three distinct persons.

Okay, that's brilliant, Matt. If if I have some time, I was also very interested in knowing a couple of things. One, in your opinion, does the Trinitarian conception of God solve the problem of the one and the many? Yes, that's one idea. the The other that I wanted to present to you.

Is have you ever seen the twenty first letter of the Hebrew alphabet, the Shin? Have ever seen what that actually looks like? It's kind of astonishing in a way. Can you hold on? We got a break, okay, brother?

We'll get back. Absolutely, you got. Excuse me, excuse me for the coughs, folks. We'll be right back after these messages. Please stay tuned.

It's Matt Slick live taking your calls at eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six. Here is Matt Slick. Everybody, welcome back to the show.

Sorry about the coughs, and we'll get back on with Daniel from New York. You still there, brother? I sure am. Thank you so much, Mister Slick. All right, call me.

Yes, I just.

Okay, thank you, thank you, Matt. I don't want to get too mystical or speculative here, but one thing that I found very interesting was coming across the Hebrew letter Shin, the twenty-first letter of the Hebrew alphabet. If you can look that up at any time, it's kind of astonishing because it is supposed to represent El Shaddai. It's supposed to be a symbol of God Almighty. And it's actually three upward flames that look like a crown.

And what's kind of astonishing is it's this three pronged visual symbol that's united in an essential baseline.

So it's almost as if, don't want to speculate too much. It's pointing to the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit united in one stable foundation, one stable essence. And furthermore, Matt, in although I'm Christian and I don't subscribe to Jewish Kabbalah or mysticism, it is interesting that in their tradition, it's also a symbol for fire. And divine warmth, and it's fascinating that the the spirit and God is referred to as this consuming fire, and that one will be baptized with the Holy Spirit and fire.

So, oh, and last but not least, you might find this interesting. Matt, it has a numerological value of three hundred.

So there's that three again. Yeah, mixing gematria, and yeah, I'm glad you brought up Kabbalah. That it's not that you want to get into that. Yeah, I understand what you're saying. The Shin, three vertical things in one.

But my recommendation is to simply go with what the scripture clearly says, and not focus too much on the the shapes of letters. Though there are some interesting things about them, I do know that because they're kind of ancient pictographs that came into into bear. In fact, I don't know if you are aware of this. If you studied ancient Chinese characters that are like thousands of years old, they wow. You should look into it because it's bizarre.

the the idea of the idea of I think remember some of them. Sin is a symbol of a tree with a snake in it. That is astonishing. Oh yeah, stuff just lots of stuff like that. And oh yeah, a boat.

The symbol for boat is a is a boat symbol with a number eight and mouth.

So eight people. In a boat, so it goes back to the ancient Chinese stuff. Goes back to the gospel stuff like that. That's worth looking into as well. But always go with what Scripture teaches clearly.

Always, and be careful. Absolutely, Matt. One, one final thing, and I really appreciate you just giving me a chance to dialogue with you. This perfectly leads up to the final thing that I wanted to ask you, which is. What blew me away.

What really solidified my faith in the Trinitarian conception is John fifteen twenty six. Could you please? I know you're an expert in this. Could you please just offer us some insights on John fifteen twenty six? Yeah, pulling the cough.

Sure. Man, this cough.

So when the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, and is the Spirit of Truth who proceeds from the Father, He'll testify about Me. It's a good Trinitarian verse. The Helper is of course the Holy Spirit who was sent by the Son from the Father.

So we have the Father, Son, Holy Spirit right there. And the Son says that He's the Spirit of Truth who proceeds from the Father.

So it's really interesting stuff. It's one of the verses along with John fourteen twenty six that John. Fourteen twenty-six, John fifteen twenty-six, which fourteen twenty-six says, "The Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, bring to remembrance all that I've I said to you." So I use these verses together to show the demonstration, the deity of Christ, and also the undergirding principle of Trinitarianism that are present in Scripture.

Now, you said something we didn't get into: the issue of the one and the many. I'm, I'm, yes, yes, yes. I'm not. I rarely hear anybody talk about this issue because I bring it up on the radio and in debates. I do the issue of one of the many solved by the Trinitarian doctrine.

So where did you learn that particular thing?

Well, to be honest with you, Matt, I I am a amateur fanatic of philosophy, so I really love looking into Aristotle's the One of the Many, and I am a Christian, and and the more I studied Trinitarian passages in the Bible, I said, Eureka! This completely solves the metaphysical conundrum of the One of the Many. Absolutely. And and I did hear you bring this up in a couple of debates. I said that's brilliant that you would, that he would make that connection.

Yes, it's philosophically very good, and. I use it against any Unitarian believer, someone who believes that God exists only as one person, which then means I'll familiarize the listeners for this, which then means that the ultimate beginner, the ultimate foundation of all things, is a single unity, not even excuse me, a single unit. Not a unity, but a single unit.

So the ultimate of all things is a single person.

Well, then, how do you justify diversity of particulars, universals and particulars? How do you justify the particulars from a perspective where everything traces back to the ultimate foundation of just one single thing? And this is why it's problematic for the unitarian position. And I'm getting a bit more deeply, but yeah, I'm quite familiar with it and have used it many, many times. You're exactly right, and.

And by the way, you you've brilliantly articulated that position, and and it reminds me of this. Of course, I'm only speaking metaphorically here, but when we have the conception of God as the logos, and we look into basic studies in logic, we have to talk about the axiomatic foundation of all beliefs. And to posit that God is the logos, as you said, the the unified starting point of all reality. That that again is reaching into this very ancient idea of the logos. To help explain God's nature, what do you think about that, man?

Yes, I know what you're talking about when you get to logos as it's used philosophically in the ancient times. Always be careful about this, but you're there. One of the things I like to focus on is what is the ultimate. The ultimate is that which there's nothing greater and nothing equal. It can only be one ultimate by definition, so you can't have multiple ultimates because that's contradictory.

So, what is the ultimate source of all things? Christian, speaking to Christianity, it's the doctrine of the Trinity, and in the doctrine of the Trinity, we can then understand what we have: all knowledge is in the mind of God. And what is actualized in our realm is actualized by the decree of God, who takes a an infinite set of potentialities and actualizes a finite set, which necessitates then that He's in control of all things. And behind the scenes of all this are the thoughts of God: entreeness, cheriness, goodness, justice, and the universals that exist in the mind of God, and He's the foundation for all of these things. And then He manifests them.

As we are made in His image, are able to participate in them and see, and participate. I like to say, bumping into universals by the the understanding that all truths and all values rest in the very nature of God's mind and heart, and that He reveals them and we experience them because we're Christians, and the unbelievers can experience them, but they can't justify them. But we can. Let me go back to the issue of the Trinitarian being being the necessary precondition for all intelligibility, and. That is astonishing, Matt.

Wow, wow, wow, wow! And when you said when when you linked it to God's decrees, that's so profound because God's decrees would be represented in God's Word, and this is also a manifestation of the Logos, the Logos made flesh. And this brings us right into this John fifteen twenty six passage that continuously blows my mind because, Matt, I know I don't have to tell you this; you understand it beautifully. But when Christ actually says, When the Helper comes, whom I shall send to you from the Father, the Spirit of Truth, who proceeds from the Father, He will testify of Me. This is astonishing, because the Holy Spirit conceived of Christ, right, and and filled Christ immeasurably.

And knows the very deep things of God, yet Jesus is sending the very Spirit that conceived of Him from the Father to testify about Him. Right. Oh, it's just well. Also, it also it seems all almost fractal and just this this at every scale of exegesis. There's the the Trinitarian conception of God.

Absolutely correct. Absolutely correct. Also, go to Ephesians one four and five. He, the Father, chose us, the elect, in Him, Christ, before the foundation of the world.

So, what does it mean in Him? Has to do with federal headship and eternal decrees of God. And we, I can get into this theology too. Everything comes back to the Trinity.

Now, I was in a doctorate program a couple of years ago, but I had to drop out. It was Too slow for me, too boring. Plus, my wife's health was really deteriorating, so I I bailed. But I wanted to do my thesis on this topic that we're talking about, and I wish I could still do a doctorate on this, but I don't have time. Hey, we got to go, brother.

There's a break, okay? God bless Daniel.

Okay, you got it. Thank you. Hey folks, we'll be right back after these messages. We'll talk to Carl. Right back, please stay tuned.

It's Matt Slick live taking your calls at eight seven seven two zero seven two two seven six. Here's Matt Slick. All right, buddy, welcome back to the show. Before we get on this call, I just want to let you know that we stay on the air by your support. And we definitely do need it.

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We'll also do it. Everything you need's right there. Easy to set up and easy to stop whenever you want. Let's get to Carl from Ohio. Carl, welcome.

You're on the air. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I have a friend named Alicia, and she committed suicide. And she was a true believer.

I believe. Where is she today? If she's a true believer, she's in heaven.

Okay. We don't lose our salvation in that. Yeah. And a lot of people will say, because she did that, then she's going to go to hell because she couldn't repent of it, because it's an automatic sin. And I don't say a suicide's an automatic sin, and I've explained what I mean by that here because there are there's some issues.

But nevertheless, if you're a true believer, then you can't lose your salvation. It's not dependent upon your ability to do right or turn from doing what's wrong. God grants us faith, Leopins one twenty nine. That faith is what justifies us, Romans five one. Generally speaking, people who commit suicide are in great Despair; they have gone through.

She was suffering from depression. Yeah, major depression. Yeah. All right.

Now let's use that as an example because we have brain chemistry. And I watched my wife. She passed away a year ago this month. I watched her deteriorate and through pain and suffering, and I could see what it did to her psychologically and emotionally. And anyway, you know, she ended up passing away.

So, generally speaking, when people are so depressed, they it's like I tell people: imagine a drain; it's circling the drain. The water is going down; it's circling, and if it just continues to go, it's very difficult to stop that. Because the person gets into a bad state of mind, which causes more problems, which causes more depression, which you circle and you go back down, and a lot of times people just end their own lives, and I say that people who do this, generally speaking, are not in their right mind. And I don't mean that disrespectfully, but it's mean it. You know, it's just so much, and so people want out.

Yeah, and so I know that God is is very patient, very kind, and so therefore, does not. It's not automatically. It does not disqualify one from being saved.

Okay, so we have in the Old Testament, Abimelech had his armor bearer kill him. Samson pulled down the Philistine temple on himself. He died with his animal, so he was committing suicide right there. Doesn't mean he went to hell. Saul fell on his own sword, and so we see that there are instances in the Old Testament where people brought about their own death.

It doesn't mean they're not with the Lord.

Okay, they just sick, basically. Yeah, they're sick. And except, I'm sorry for your loss too of your wife. Yeah, appreciate that. I do.

It's been tough. But think about this. You know, what there are different situations of suicide. Let's just say that there's a a a colonel who's caught by the enemy, and during wartime, and they're torturing him. And they want the plans to the invasion, blah blah blah, so the the enemy can you know kill you know a lot of people, and he finds a way to kill himself instead of because he knows he's he's going to break, he kills himself.

Well, that I don't consider that to be sinful. I consider that to be a means by which he's saving the lives of others.

So there's there's situations that we can see. That I don't think justify the idea that all all suicide is automatically sinful.

Now, here's the thing: but people who are listening to me right now, to be very, very careful what I say. I'm no way encouraging anybody to do that. I know Canada does, but I'm not encouraging that. If you are in a situation where you're getting depressed, the way to break that cycle, that circle, is you have to reach out to somebody. You got to reach out to somebody you trust, and just tell them you're having a lot of problems, and you just someone you can trust, and then you you go to that person on a regular basis, just talk, and try and do one thing constructive, just one thing.

Make your bed. In the morning, wash dishes. You want to do something that breaks the pattern, and one little thing like making a bed is an accomplishment. And then you make it the next day. Then you make the bed and you clean a mirror in the bathroom.

Whatever it is, small things like this help break the cycle. And you need to be involved with talking to other people because they can help you and encourage you and help you see things that you can't see yourself. And then also, sleep is important. Diet is important. Supplements are important, and anybody who's in that kind of condition needs to see a doctor, because there are there are brain chemicals that can get depleted, and you can have medical drugs.

You have these drugs that are just super helpful. And okay, so I had a we had Diane. She passed away years ago. She worked with us. She was a clinical psych nurse who taught this stuff, and she said there are methods that are incredibly helpful.

To people, some people's brains are just they're malformed the way an arm might be malformed, and so their chemical makeup makes it very very difficult for them to deal with things, and so there are medicines that bring you a level a level key keel and I'll be generic here. I know I'm talking a lot because this is a serious topic. I have family members. It is. It is.

Yeah. Yeah. So I have family members who are on medications, and it levels them, and they can then cope normally. Nothing wrong with that.

So if anybody's in that situation of of that kind of dire need, you want out by suicide, just go get help. Trust somebody. Go get help, and and you'd be surprised what can happen pretty quickly. How good things can get.

Now she she was medicating with alcohol to escape.

Okay, yeah, to escape the pain of depression. And how often happens, and it it means that they understand that there's a way to help, but that kind of help needs to be guided externally, not internally, because one of the problems with with people who get suicidal is their minds are not thinking critically and properly. That's why you need the assistance of someone else. Yeah. Man, okay, yeah.

She she she tied two cinder blocks to her leg and jumped in a swimming pool and drowned. But she was a great swimmer. I'm sorry, what? And um, what what happened? She um tied two cinder blocks to her to her legs and she jumped in a swimming pool and she drowned.

Man, it just it just rocked me. Rocked me. Yeah. That's not how. Not how I'd want to go.

I mean, there's different ways I think would be less traumatizing. But that just, in my mind, that just demonstrates she was not in the right mind. Yeah. Okay. If she's a true true believer, well, she went to be with the Lord.

And that's how I see it. Yeah. Okay, Mr. Matt. Thank you very much.

I love your show. All right, man. God bless, brother. Have a good day. You too.

Folks, if any of you are contemplating suicide, just go get help. Talk to a friend you trust, and see a doctor, and they can make a world of difference in your life. It's worth it.

Okay, let's get to Keeni Kenai from North Carolina. Welcome. You're on the air. Hi, you spelled it right. You sounded right.

It was Kanai. I like it. That's a nice name, Kanai. I like it. Thank you.

So, first of all, the last caller, crazy story, because I actually lost my son back in June to drowning in a pool, a one-year-old, and yeah, it's it's rough. You know, and I've been, you know, definitely running back to the Lord for help and, you know, guidance on things. And my call is because his father, we have four children and all, and we just lost that one. And our relationship has kind of been on the brink. Wait, wait, wait, hold on.

Of it, are you saying that you lost the one year old? Yes. Oh man. Yes. Yeah, my heart just.

My heart aches for you and with you. I lost a son shortly after being born. Yeah. To lose a child, my heart just aches. It hurts with you.

So yeah, my son. Thank you so much. Thank you. Yeah, it's it's rough. It's hard to deal with.

Of course, the kids, his siblings, saw him, and they saw you know my parents doing CPR on him, and they seeing the funeral, and you know this is just a really hard time for us and our family.

So, um, like I said, me and the father were not married. And we have all these children together, and somehow, you know, we're starting to get to a point where it's kind of on the brinks of it. And of course, I'm going one way, where I'm running to the Lord, and I just can't wait for Him to come to.

Okay, let me ask you some questions.

Okay, we only have a few minutes, so I have to do it quickly. Not trying to be rude, but just trying to get through things quickly.

Okay, can I ask some questions? All right.

So, are you living with this man now that you're not married to? Yes. Okay. So you need to stop that.

Okay, and you need to find a way to not live in sin. That's that's okay. That's one of the things that's got to be done. And if you're going to church, you need to talk to the elders. If you are living with this guy, and if if he's a believer and you are a believer, you need to repent of the sin of fornication, living together.

Okay, and I am not judging you. I am not throwing rocks at you. All right, just saying that this is what we as Christians need to do. And the Lord is very forgiving. He's very patient.

He's very kind, and He loves when we seek repentance. And that's what the blood of Christ enables us to be able to do. And so you need to take care of those things soon, okay? Because you can't you can't seek the Lord and have true fellowship with Him while you're also contradicting what He's commanded, okay? Again, I'm not judging you here.

I completely understand. No, that's funny that you say that because that's what's been going in my head.

So obviously, you're just confirmation of what the Holy Spirit has been telling me. Good.

So, are you going to church? I just needed confirmation. Yeah, we we both go to church together, and okay.

So you know, I've been consistent and.

Okay, we've got like thirty seconds, so I am sorry for interrupting you. You need to either get married, ASAP, if you are both believers, and or you separate, and then you decide what to do at this point. But you need to have the elders of your church involved.

Okay, you need to do this. Just do it. Do it quickly, and you can call back. And I am not going to, I am not going to bash you or something like that. I am just informing you.

Okay, and oh no, no. All right, okay, okay. Thank you so much. And there's the music, Kenai.

So I love that name.

So, but call back, okay? Let me know what happens. All right, we got to go because there's the end of the show. I will.

Okay, God bless. No, you're fine. Thank you. Bye.

Okay. Well, I wish we had more time to talk about that.

Sorry to have to kind of rush through it, but we're out of time. May the Lord bless you all, and by His grace, back on here. Please remember to support us; we definitely need it. Karma.org. God bless.

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