Poetry, Pain and Providence

This is the Truth Network. Welcome to Hope in the Morning, turning tragedies and tears into testimonies of hope. Welcome to Hope in the Morning. Today is a special episode. We are actually talking about poetry, pain, and providence.

And if you've gone through a hard season, which who of us haven't? Finding comfort in the power of the pen is a pretty mighty tool because it allows us to express what is deep in our heart and actually put it to word. And when we do that, we can then also pen truth, which leads to praise.

So my guest today is a dear friend from a very long time ago, actually, Kristen. And Kristen, I was thinking about the fact that not only did we go to the Masters University together, and you and I both were heavily Involved in the music, the music industry there, the music, whatever you call it, the music side of things. But we also we both worked for the Fred Bach Music Publishing Company at the same. And I had almost forgotten that detail that we were both there, and that was that was such a fun thing to do. That and that was actually when you were pregnant with your first child.

Oh my goodness! That seems like forever ago, but the memories are rolling in. How wild that Jesus has reconnected us, and to be able to glorify Him together through just simple conversation about who He is and what He has done in our lives. This is really, really neat. Yeah, and I mean, you always in college, like you had one of my favorite voices.

You just have one of these singing voices that brings music to life. You put a lot of heart behind your music, and so it's not it's not just notes. You bring it to life, and you put so much beauty behind it. And then you pair that with the beautiful tone that God has given you, and it's just such a treat. And if you're listening right now, she's actually going to sing for us in a little bit, so you're not going to want to miss that because it really is like I'm excited about it.

But we're we're talking. Talking today about the fact that poetry can be such a healing thing. When you're going through a hard time, it can be great. When you're wondering what to say to somebody else, when they're in the midst of a hard time, it can also be very healing. And Kristen, you are in the midst right now of your own hard season.

And can you briefly tell us kind of what's going on in your own world right now? Of course, for the past decade or so, the Lord has blessed me with very difficult chronic pain and random symptoms, and trying to navigate how to wisely manage diet, nutrition, activities, exercise, all the normal everyday things, finally came to a head about three years ago when I was. Gifted with 80 extra pounds in a year, and realized, oh, maybe this is not something I can do on my own.

So finally, at that point, pursued some specialists and did 187 million tests, and finally discovered that we are dealing with a Cushing's syndrome, which is essentially a tumor sitting on a part of your brain that gives you way, way too much cortisol.

So you're in a regular state. Of fight or flight, all those stress hormones that, when when they're used appropriately, are beautiful tools for us to manage our body well. But when you have 700 percent too much, it makes life a little interesting. And so, in the midst of finding out that there is a diagnosis, which hallelujah in and of that, just the fact that to have an answer is such a beautiful Beautiful gift to know what's wrong. It takes away so much stress in and of itself, and then to realize that instead of it being a syndrome where I am just blessed with all of these symptoms for the rest of my life, it is actually something that is operable with a very high percentage of folks coming out of the surgery with all of those symptoms going away within five years.

That is absolutely thrilling.

So I'm not going to minimize the fact that I have a brain tumor. I'm not going to minimize the fact that brain surgery is a really big deal. But to have the hope that this could allow me to experience a a lack of pain, a lack of really really hard things, this side of heaven is absolutely thrilling.

So to know. That Jesus has walked me through so many really really hard things leading up to this point. Whether I was in elementary school and I experienced my first significant death in my family, to high school where there was there were people in my life that were very very challenging, to college and so many broken relationships and hard times there, and then as adulthood going through really difficult times in. Marriage and ministry. Jesus has shown so much of Himself.

He has shown Himself to be good. He has shown Himself to be faithful. And because of Him walking me through His character for my entire life, I can stand here now and go, "This is so cool! I cannot wait to see how Jesus is going to use this because He's been faithful to use everything else." And so here I am with the brain. Tumor and God is still good, Kristen.

One of the reasons I wanted to have you on is because I've been seeing your Facebook posts, and you know, not very many people have the reaction that you had when you found out when you got the diagnosis that you had a brain tumor. And I was just like, oh man, the people would be so encouraged to to hear this. And like you said, it doesn't minimize the fact that there's some scary elements in here. There's some unknowns. You just You don't know what this is going to lead to, but you can see the faithfulness of the Lord, and you can trust His character.

And so, in that, like, what a cool thing to have you here today and see you just like radiating joy. Which I think that that truly comes from us having a spirit of trusting the Lord. You can either choose to be in fear and despair, or you can choose to have hope, and you can cling to that joy that Jesus has given you. And I'm just so excited to have you on today and kind. Of talk about talk about your music, talk about your poetry, how you are processing everything.

Another element that that I think that our listeners would be interested in knowing is you have four kids at home, and one of which is actually pretty little.

So, how old are all four of your kids? I have three teens and a toddler: eighteen, fifteen, twelve, and just barely two. And so, looking at how life was. We thought we knew what Jesus was up to, and we were following and obeying and being faithful and pursuing excellence. And Jesus said, "Good job." Oh, by the way.

Let's pivot and handed us a baby, handed us a total career change, handed us a move across the state, and it's been really wild and very exciting. And turns out that when Jesus gives you something, whether it is a diagnosis of a really hard health thing or such a beautiful thing as an unexpected pregnancy and the subsequent baby that is now a toddler climbing into the dishwasher every other day, it is a good, really beautiful. Beautiful thing, and it is usually the puzzle piece that we didn't even know we were missing. Yeah, the Lord, the Lord's ways are higher than our ways, you know. And oftentimes we think we know the plan, and we think we think we have it laid out so perfectly.

And then the Lord is like, "No, that's that's not the plan." I actually had a guest on yesterday, and she said something in her book that I think was so great. And she said that all of our disappointments actually are just there are appointments that are getting messed up because God's appointments never fail. His appointments for us never fail, and.

So there's no such thing. If we're just completely surrendering to the Lord and what His desires are for our life, there's no such thing as disappointments because He will ordain all things for His purposes, for our good, for His glory. And I think the hardest part there is even as believers learning to have that surrender because it's easy to say that it's not as easy to do that in practice. And I was going to ask you too before we move on to starting to share, you know, our poetry and the stories behind those. Did you always kind of have this spirit from the time you were, say, high school?

Let's take it from high school, where you kind of could just say, "This is going to be good," and I can have a good attitude about this. Or did the Lord grow you more in the last couple years in that way? I wish I could say I have a natural faith, but no, this is not a talent. This is absolutely 100% a skill, being that it has to be practiced. For me, at least, I was the one who, growing up, I had a little pink fanny pack, and I would fill that with all of the whatifs and just in cases, because I was sure I was going to be kidnapped and then tied to a rock in the middle of this labyrinthian cave.

So I would need to pack. Floss, floss, so I could tie it to the rock and find my way out of that maze. I knew that I needed to have band aids and a and a pocket knife and anything that would possibly get me out of whatever situation that was doomed to happen. And I never once ended up using that pink fanny pack for any of my worst case scenarios.

So to be more succinct, no, I did not have faith until a lot, lot later when I was. Was pushed to the point of realizing that I could not care for myself. I could not anticipate the future. I could not prepare for things, and I was absolutely brought to the very broken parts of my own heart. And in that, Jesus showed that He Was faithful.

He was going to hold on to me, and it didn't matter how tightly I was holding on to him. Even if I was shaken, he would never be shook. Yeah.

Well, man. I mean, with with that segue, when we come back from the break in a minute, we're gonna we're gonna have you sing your song because I think I think that's a great place to to sing the song that that we've chosen for you to share today, which is He will hold me fast. I've asked you if you would share a song that. You've kind of clung to during this season. It's one of the questions that we asked our authors in Hope in the Morning: Is what music, what hymns, what songs did you cling to on the hardest days and nights?

Because music. Has has a very unique way of ministering to our hearts. You see that all throughout the Psalms. I mean, David was he was a musician, and so much of what we read as poetry in the Psalms, Psalms he would have actually sung. And there's there's such a richness in those lyrics and things that again, like he will hold me fast.

There's so much truth that you can speak to your own heart in those dark valleys. And I can't help but wonder if the Lord takes people like you. You were when you were young, and so many of us that are listening and participating in your episode today that struggle with anxiety, and the Lord shakes us to show us like that anxiety is rooted in control. Really, it's rooted in us feeling like. We get fearful of what we don't have control of, and that results in anxiety.

And the more things the Lord strips from our lives, the more we realize you don't have any control over anything. I mean, you have. I honestly, I mean, I've seen people that that put a tremendous amount of time and energy into health, and the Lord says, "No, I'm going to call you into a health crisis," and Same with like people can try for years and years to have a baby, and the Lord says no. And there can be people that try for years and years not to have a baby, and the Lord says, here's your toddler, with your teenagers. And so, our our plans are not always good.

In fact, a lot of times they are second rate at best. And yet the Lord says, I don't want you to live a life full of anxiety. Surrender it to me. Realize that you're not in control. Don't fear.

You don't need to fear when I'm in control.

So when we come back, we're gonna have Kristin sing for us. He will hold me fast, and I think it will be a tremendous blessing to those of you listening. Join us again in a moment on Hope in the Morning. Do you have a testimony of hope? Perhaps you've walked through depression or addiction.

Maybe you were diagnosed with a serious illness or have suffered the life-altering death of a loved one. If you want to encourage others with your testimony and share the light of Jesus, visit hopeinthe morning. dot org and submit your story. Your story might be just what someone else needs to hear to find hope in their morning. Do you have a heart to comfort the hurting?

Do you want to show the world that through Jesus Christ we can have hope in all circumstances?

Well then, we welcome you to visit hopeinthe morning dot org and see how you can join us in these ministry endeavors. May you be encouraged by who our God is as you continue this episode of Hope in the Morning. To learn more, visit us at hopeinthe morning dot org. If you ever struggled to comfort a grieving friend, John 11:35 says Jesus wept. When Jesus was told by Mary and Martha that their brother Lazarus had died, Jesus wept.

Today on Hope in the Morning, we invite you to learn what it looks like to weep with those who weep. Learn what it means to sit in the ashes and be encouraged that even in our mourning, there's hope. His name is Jesus. Visit hopeintheMorning.org to learn more. Welcome back to Hope in the Morning.

I am joined today with Kristen Hunt, and we're talking about poetry and pain and providence. And she shared with us that she is actually facing brain surgery soon, very soon, like in like a week, week and a half, right? And yet, she has this joyful disposition, and it's not because her circumstances are easy. It's because she knows who holds her in them. And I had asked her if she would share one of the songs that's just been like continually on her mind and heart during this season, and the one that she told me is Keith and Kristen Getty's "He Will Hold Me Fast," which I love.

And Kristen, will you sing for us? Kristen. When I fear my faith will fail, Christ will hold me fast. When the tempter would prevail, He will hold me fast. I could never keep my hold through life's fearful path.

For my love is oft in cold, he must hold me fast. He will hold me fast. He will hold me fast. For my savior loves me so. He will hold me fast.

That was beautiful. I love the lyrics in that song. I think so many of us that have been in those deep waters—that's the anchor. Because there, there are times, Kristen. I don't know if you have felt this, but I know in my own heart, and even in many of the guests we've had, there are times when you are in those, those rocky seasons, and you wonder: Is my faith going to survive this?

If it gets harder than this, will I crumble? Will my faith survive? And having that theology to speak to ourself that it's not us. That maintain our salvation. It's the Lord that chose us before the foundations of the earth.

He's the one that will hold you fast. He's the one giving you joy in this season. What have the lyrics of that song done for you in this in this season of struggle? I used to think that the verse about nothing you can take you out of the Father's hand, nothing can separate us from His love. I thought that was all talking about our external circumstances, the hard things that happen, the princes of the power of the air, and all of the spiritual warfare and other people being really difficult.

And it wasn't until probably five years ago that I realized that there was a fear in my heart that something I could do that might rob me of God's love. And to be reminded that there is nothing that can ever make Him let go of me was so incredibly encouraging, to the point that I would say that it lent a courageousness to my. Faith, thinking about as as a father walks through a treacherous path with his with his young daughter, he's holding on to her hand. She's a lot more comfortable when she holds on tightly as well. But even if she lets go or squirms around, he is not going to loosen his grip, not even a bit.

And if that is how it works with a loving father, he on earth, imagine the depths of that love and how tightly. He holds on to us. It's it's never been my faith. This is a gift of God. My faith is from the Lord, and He's the one who sustains it.

So when I get to the places where, in light of miscarriages and hard things, and death and grieving and so much weight in this world, when I get to my end, when I've dealt with depression. And suicidal thoughts, and bitterness, and anger, and everything that is is awful. I never have to question God's love for me, His hold on me, and the fact that He sustains my faith, regardless of how broken I will ever be. Kristen, that is beautifully said, and one of the reasons why we share testimonies like yours here on Hope in the Morning because other believers and unbelievers need to hear the fact that Christians struggle with these same things within our own flesh. We struggle with with what you said.

We struggle with the depression. We struggle with suicidal thoughts. We struggle with a faith that on our own is weak, but. As much as as it is difficult, the Lord strengthens our faith through our trials, and He strips away, as we spoke of earlier, He strips away those anxieties, as we learn to trust Him in those trials, and it may not seem like a gift then. But it is a gift because, in the end, on the other side of that, you can look back and you can say, "I don't carry the pink fanny pack anymore.

I don't need it. I know what God has promised me. I know that God is not going to. He's not going to leave me tied to that rock with no resource and no, no savior. He has come, and we we are told that there will be trouble in this earth, but we we can take heart because He's overcome it, and Doesn't mean that our our life here is going to be easy.

We are not guaranteed an easy life, and we've even talked time and time again on hope in the morning. I think most of us think initially that, like, I am going to have that one big trial, and once I get over that one big trial, it's going to be pretty smooth sailing. And man, Kristen, I have met some people that I told my husband just yesterday. I said, you know, so and so. Seems to be like called to suffering, and it's so hard when when you're watching even someone you love go through that.

But as believers, praying for one another, upholding each other's hands, sometimes being that Aaron to their Moses, and saying, "Let me help hold your weary hands when you're too weak to worship right now, when you're you're on the ground weeping." And the worship, Kristen, even in hearing you sing that song, our worship in a season of weeping and a season of unknown is a completely different kind of worship than that which comes out of joy. And it is, I think that there's so much more beauty in it because it costs us something. You know, it's us saying, Lord. I surrender my health to you. I surrender what my future may or may not look like.

I surrender my children. I entrust them to you during this season. It costs us something.

So, Kristen, I know that you are, as we just demonstrated, a beautiful musician, but you're also a poet. And I've asked you if you would bring a couple poems on here, and you and I are going to actually go back and forth with a couple of our poems and talk about. We'll read them, and then we'll talk about what what season that poem was born out of.

So, can you read us one of your poems? Yes. Once upon a time, not too long ago, Jesus was. Going to take yet another thing away that I thought was beautiful, right and good, and He had a better plan in store. And having seen His goodness leading up to that point, I was willing to say, "And if not, He is still good." So this is "and if not." It's so easy to say thank you for the thing, things my heart desires, when gratitude and trust are what I know the Lord requires.

But when His blessings come with thorns, and His love is shown through scars, it's hard to rest amidst the fire when every comfort seems too far. I've seen His constant guidance through the valleys and the night. I know Him to be peace and joy and comfort, hope and light. Yet too often, when my heart is spent, and my soul is tired and worn, I forget His faithful presence and His goodness through the storm. Oh, were all that my pleas were granted, and my every cry fulfilled, and my every deep desire be that which He has willed.

Would my every complaint quickly be resolved, and I would hear His voice every time I called? And if not, He is still good. And if not, he is faithful. And if not, I will trust in who he has promised to be good, for he is faithful to be good, and he is good to me. The more I trust in knowing that my God is sovereign, still to work each moment beautifully according to His will, infusing His own glory in all things perfectly, the more I see His glory and His goodness toward me.

Were that all my pleas were granted, and every cry fulfilled, and my every desire be that which He has willed, would my every complaint quickly be resolved, and I would hear His voice every time I called. And if not, he is still good. And if not, he is faithful. And if not, I will trust him in who he has promised to be, for he is faithful to be good, and he is good to me. Hmm.

Wow. What what a beautiful poem. And you were saying that you wrote that in the midst of. A season that you thought you were requesting something that you thought was good, and we do that so often. Whether it is the sustaining of of a pregnancy or the sustaining of our child's health or our own health or marriage, you know there there are men and women out there who desperately desire to be married, and the Bible says those are good good things.

All of those are good things, and it can leave our heart really wondering why. Lord, I'm praying for something that you you clearly say is good, but you're saying it's not good for me. You're saying it's not good for me right now. And what a place of surrender. Did you, when you wrote that, did you feel that it kind of took some weight off of your heart?

It really did. I'm finding that. Poetry is a little bit removed from the way we normally speak and think and read books because poetry comes out of. An emotional foundation most of the time, and when we are emotional, sometimes there are no words.

Sometimes there are gasps and groans in the midst of grieving.

Sometimes there are shouts and exultation, and simply dancing in the midst of our joy. And sometimes those don't come out in full, complete sentences with regular grammatical putting-togetherness. It just—it's words, and some of them are beautiful. And some of them are grungy, but all of them equip us to communicate that which is felt deep, deep is within us.

So yes, poetry definitely helps me understand better how I view the world, and can then balance that against reality and who God says He is. Absolutely, and when we continue the podcast portion of this, we're going to continue talking through some of our poetry and how the Lord actually birthed more dependence on Him and allowed us to write truth to balance some of the fears that we were feeling, some of the heartaches that we had. I like you, so I have several several poems that I wrote in in the Hope in the Morning book, and they didn't all necessarily come from. A personal place, like they weren't—they weren't this heavy pouring out of my spirit. But there are some that definitely were, and when you go back and read them, you can remember exactly how you felt when you penned those.

And I even can think through, and I—I don't know if this is the same for you, Kristen. There have been some poems that I've written that took me a while to share with anybody because they felt so close to my heart that it felt like. I don't know. I don't know how to put it. It almost felt like I was exposing a very vulnerable part of myself to put this poem out in the world, or even to call my mom and say, "Hey, you want to hear what I just wrote?" It there was so much vulnerability in it that it took time to actually want to present that to somebody other than the Lord.

I'm gonna I'm gonna read one of my poems that I have here as well, and. This is actually so. This is a poem. Most of my poems rhyme. That's what most poem, what most poetry does.

Although not all poetry does. And I actually wrote this, I guess, about a year ago. And we were we were in a cabin, and it was one of those things where. Like you, Kristen, the more suffering you go through, you learn to have this grateful heart for what you do have, what God has said yes to, what He has deemed good for you. And we were at this cabin.

We go to a cabin every Fourth of July with our kids. It's kind of become a tradition up in the mountains. And the day that we left to go on that trip, my mom actually called me and said that my grandfather had taken his last breath and that he was in glory. And of course, we are thrilled for him, but grieved for ourselves. And it hadn't been that long since we had lost my dad and a son of our own, and yet.

The Lord showed His little mercies, and here we are in this cabin, and I've got two of my kids in my arms, sleeping, and and they're not tiny babies; they're not toddlers. You know, at that point, I think they were like five and seven, so it was rare for them to climb up in my lap and let me actually rock them to sleep. And so I wrote, I wrote this with them, like as soon as we put them down, I went into our room and I wrote this. It said. Tonight I had the privilege of rocking not one but two of my babies to sleep.

They are bigger than the baby I envisioned rocking this summer, but to feel the weight of their little frames in my arms brought so much comfort to my hurting heart. The Lord knew that I needed that, and in His mercy, He provided it. As I rocked them, he allowed the tears to flow freely. As I mourned, I mourned my unborn son, my father, my grandfather. I mourned the other two tiny souls that went straight from my womb to the arms of Jesus.

This year, this is mercy, allowing treasured moments to mingle with sorrow. He is faithful. My heart knows it well. I I love clinging to Psalm 139, where it talks about how we were woven together in the hidden places of the womb, and I love the the line where it talks about how, he he is good. My soul knows it very well.

And in the end, our souls do know that. But there is this wrestling between our flesh and our spirit when we go through these hard times. And when we're able to sit down and say, "Lord, I'm going to pour forth my heart right now—the good, the bad, the raw, everything—I'm gonna lay it out." But I feel like the spirit inside of us, as believers, then. It stirs something. I don't know if this is true of you, Kristen, but from me, it stirs something in me, where the Holy Spirit reminds my soul of these truths, and I cannot help but turn this poetry.

Into truth, which then results in praise. There's there's no other way truly for a believer. I'm I'm convinced of it. How have you seen the Lord use your writings and the time that you sit down and decide to put your pain to pen, to kind of refine some of your theology and wipe clean some of the dross? Refining theology—that's a very apt way to put it, because there are things that I know.

There are some things that I think that I know, and there are a whole lot of things that I feel. And feelings are a beautiful tool that the Lord has given us to allow us to better understand what we believe to be true. But the feelings themselves may not be truth. And so, in taking everything that I feel and being able. Able to put them into words often gives me the chance to look at them objectively and to better understand that if I am feeling anxiety, then that simply means that I am not trusting the sovereignty of God, because there is a direct parallel between the trust we have in Jesus and the peace in our hearts when we trust Him, when we know.

Him. When we know him to be good, we can then trust everything that pours out of that goodness, and with that, we can trust his plan. And if we can trust his plan, then we do not have to worry about the outcome because he's got it, and he's promised that it will be the very best for us. And that best is simply that we will know him more, we will love him more, and we will look more like him. Him.

So, in pinning the pain, it really does refine that theology. What do we believe about who God is? Why does it matter? And then, then being able to have that information, then applying that to how we go and take our next step. Yeah, using our theology as the lens for our suffering, rather than our suffering as the lens for our theology, is the difference between despair and hope.

And we talked—we've talked several times in this episode about anxiety. And we have—we have nine pastors as part of our ministry, and one of the pastors, Todd Smith, we were speaking—it just aired actually this past week. On is it—is it wrong to be angry? Because so many times that's one of our natural Natural emotions that comes up when plans do not go our way, when we've asked for something that we deem is good and right, and God says no to to something that we thought certainly He would say yes to, and we talked about the fact that oftentimes fear is actually like the pinnacle point of.

Sorry, anger is the pinnacle point of fear, and grief can be underneath that. And so you can you can experience grief, and out of that flows this fear. Whether it's a fear of can I trust God. Am I? Am I going to?

Is my health going to decline? Is God going to take this child? What's next? Is the other shoe going to drop? We have all these fears, and then that can lead to anger.

Whether we feel like God is not protecting us, God is not keeping us from this harm, or even where we may we may feel like we've been abandoned—all things that are untrue, but. The the devil is working too, and we have to remember that we we live in a spiritual realm as well. And it's easy for us just to focus on the physical realm, but there's a very real spiritual warfare that Scripture talks about, and that's why we have to have the armor of God. We have to be equipped with with a shield and with the sword of God's word to know truth and preach it to yourself. And if you're in a season when you can't preach it to yourself, and sometimes we are.

You got to go to somebody that can preach it to you kindly, with compassion. But you got to have it. And when you when God strips away the anxiety and the fear, you are far less likely. And I say this with a convicted heart because I've had many seasons of entering grief, and my initial thing that spills out is anger. And my husband has been the one that has come to me multiple times and.

Had to say, you know, Emily, this is not—you are not putting your theology into action. And I have found that there are seasons when it's very hard to reconcile your feelings and your theology. And when that's the case, we have to let our theology triumph. We cannot—we have to take those thoughts captive. And it's hard in the face of grief.

It is, but then when you can see brothers and sisters who come on like you, Kristen, who are getting. Ready to face a a challenge, and not just getting ready to face a challenge. You have faced years of challenges, and so when you can have someone come on, and place that stone of remembrance and say, "My God's been faithful. He's not going to change. Doesn't change.

So He will be faithful again." I wanted to ask you real quick too. How has your family, your children, your husband, how have they been responding to the trial that they're now faced with as well in your life? I have found that when we communicate truth with joy and great hope and expectation, the people receiving that truth. Are more likely to live in that same joy and hope and expectation, and so as we've been communicating to the kids, and of course the toddler doesn't know what's going on; she just wants to know where the fishy crackers are. But the big kids, seeing how they've responded, they're having to walk their own journey of knowing who God is, and why it matters, and how it applies.

And it's been really, really sweet and very beautiful to see them responding in different. My let's see, my twelve-year-old, she just wants to hang out with us. She is more excited about being with her boring parents. My teenager, my let's see, my fifteen-year-old, she's now, she is a little bit more pensive, and she's thinking through things a little more deeply. And then my freshly eighteen-year-old son, he just comes out of the woodwork, and he just gives me a hug.

And just really holding on to me, and it's just been very, very sweet.

So, in regards to them processing, I think they're going to have to process this really big thing for a very long time, and they have to build up their understanding of seeing God be faithful, and my our hope. Is that as the Lord brings us through this surgery experience, that He will answer our prayers for health and healing, and in that, I want my children to see that He delights, that the Lord delights in giving us comfortable things. And even if that's not the case, if there are complications, then I want them to see that the Lord delights in giving us good things that go way beyond comfort and convenience. But either way, I this is one of the biggest things that they will have ever had to go through in their young lives so far, and I need to example trust and faith well in front of them, just to give them an example as. To how much joy and peace is available when you walk with Jesus through hard things, Kristen?

Has God changed your perspective on what is good? Oh, absolutely! The greatest good is Jesus, and if He needs to take everything else out of my life so that He is the only thing left, then what I have. Is good. It is the greatest good.

It is the deepest good. It is the most eternal good, and it is unfathomable. And so often, I have so many really wonderful things. I've got great plans, and I like nice things, and I love to be comfortable. And none of that is bad in and of itself, until they become more important than my desire to look like Christ.

And when I signed up for this whole Christian thing, I was signing up to say, "Yes, Lord, be Lord," and that means that my number one goal is to know God more, to love God more, and look more like Him. That's the end goal. And if that remains my goal and my passion and the reason I do anything, then that goal I have to be on board with. How the Lord, in His infinite love and goodness, in His plan, to bring that about in the best, most efficient way, even if it means taking away everything else that I think is nice. To trade it for that which is truly, truly good.

Yeah, well, and that is that's where in lies the error of the prosperity gospel, because prosperity gospel teaches that it is earthly things that are good. When God says that He will give us all good things, and you know James talks about that, that every good gift comes down from the Father of lights, with whom there is no variableness or shifting shadow, and that's not what it means. I mean, the best gift is the gift of himself. It's the gift of us learning, like just like you said, Kristen. When all else is taken away.

He will be faithful. He will be there. He will never leave you. He will never forsake you. But the prosperity gospel flips that and puts an emphasis and a focus on that which is earthly, and not that which is eternal.

It doesn't put our focus on the Lord. It's a focus on self, ultimately. And yet we've learned on this show time and time again that when we do that examining of our theology, when we refine our theology. Oftentimes, you'll find that we all have a little bit of the prosperity gospel in our own hearts that we're clinging to. That we think, "Oh, no, I'm serving you, Lord.

I'm doing good things for the kingdom. Surely, surely, you want to give something temporal back to me, you know." And the the Lord's beyond that. The Lord sees so much farther than just what we can see here in the temporal. And Kristen, with the with the last couple minutes that we have, I would love if you had another poem that you could read us and and walk us through. What a what a beautiful privilege for you to let us enter into your writing.

Well, of course. You were talking about anger and how it can be the Feeding ground for all of these other really, really difficult things, and that all is battled by our trust in God's sovereignty. And I had to learn that in a very fresh, new way. When my husband's father left his mom after 35 years of marriage and the subsequent hurt and the fallout of that, it was really, really difficult. And I really had to struggle with my anger and what I knew to be true.

And I had to choose. To trust, I know my God is faithful. I know my God is true. I know my God works every bitter circumstance for good. I trust His hand of kindness.

I trust His hand of love. I trust Him to provide for me that He will be enough. But my heart is aching, and my soul is dry. I'm lost and caught and tired and scared, with an ocean to cry, and I feel abandoned. I feel alone.

I feel forsaken, unloved and forgotten in the dark and on my own. And though I know what's true, my heart can't understand how love and grace could hurt so deep, how joy can taste so bland.

So even in my anger, in the depths of hurt and pain, I choose to trust that God still loves, and that I will hope again. I love the the rhythm of your poetry. You know, just it has it has such a um. It has a canter that that sounds like you're just speaking it. It's just pouring out from your heart, and it just so happens to have a rhyme every once in a while.

But that that also like that's a skill from the Lord to be able to write like that and be able to have your emotions that can come out and and be beautifully expressed and in a way that can meet the hearts of others too. Here it pours out your own heart, but Kristen, I am certain that many people that have just heard your poem will resonate with it and feel like that—that's what I'm feeling. That that puts life to my feelings, and and again, being able to bring it back to biblical truth. And if if you're listening today, and you're a writer. I just I want to talk to us as writers for a second because as believers and as writers, I think that there's a there's a responsibility there for us to make sure that what we are penning is truth, what we are penning is accurate, that we are being careful.

It can be really easy for us to have phrases from the world that we maybe don't even realize are from the world and not from scripture. We we need to test our our poetry, our song lyrics against that, because those are going to be some words that some people cling to in a hard season, and we want them to cling to the Lord, to cling to His word, not not our words. Our words mean nothing. The only thing that makes them powerful is the truth within them.

So you know, oftentimes, like even when I write poetry, a lot of times I will base my poems. Like in the book, all of the poems at the end have a verse, and the verse is basically like it's a theme verse of of that poetry. And I chose to do that partly because. I wanted people to read the poem and be encouraged by the poem, but ultimately, I wanted them to see the truth lies in this scripture. Here's where God actually says that to you.

Here's where God says that when you go through deep waters, I am with you. Here's where God says, "I will never leave you. I will never forsake you." Here's where God says, "Be strong. Be courageous," and That's what we can cling to, and as writers, that's what we should propel other people towards. And as we as we close out this episode, I'm gonna I'm gonna read a poem.

I I wrote this one when my dad was dying. I wrote this for him, and it it so reminds me, Kristen, of the attitude that you're having towards your towards your circumstances as well. And I hope that as we conclude this episode. All of us can have this attitude towards our sufferings. It's called sweet suffering, and it says, "It is not thine comforts which you had mentioned, Kristen, that quickly fade upon which a foundation of character is laid.

Each brick of suffering securely lands in its intended place in the builder's hands. Find strength in the sorrow, for suffering is sweet when it leads you to fall at the Savior's feet." Cling not tightly to the gifts you lay claim. Offer them freely. Find peace in His name. Know the hand of the Lord is kind.

He hems you in both before and behind. Find strength in the sorrow, for suffering is sweet when it leads you to surrender at the Savior's feet. Remember the example of the Lord Jesus Christ as He submitted to the Father and poured out His life. May we count it joy to suffer for His name, and never forget that He died for our shame. Find strength in the sorrow, for suffering is sweet when we know we'll soon be in glory at the Savior's feet.

And Kristen, that is the hope we have. That's the hope you have. That's what is the difference between us suffering well. And not is are we keeping our gaze fixed on Jesus and the sure and steady hope of heaven that we have to come, or are we focused on this life? If we focus on the promises of what is sure to come, our suffering can be sweet.

It makes us more like Jesus every time. Doesn't feel good in the moment, but you will look back and you will say, you know, I. I love the Lord more. I trust the Lord more, and I reflect His image more than I did a year ago because of what He has done. Kristen, we are going to be praying for your family, praying for the outcome of your surgery, and I actually have this episode for those of you that are listening.

This is actually airing within days of your surgery. And so, as you're listening to this, just stop. Take a moment. Pray for Kristen. Pray for her family.

Pray for the hearts of her children. That the Lord, for those that may not be believers of your children, the Lord would use this to show them your joy, your faith, and that they might come to know the Lord. And many others as well. And Kristen, thank you for joining us today on Hope and One. It has been my joy.

Thank you. Hope in the Morning is a nonprofit ministry that seeks to encourage the hurting, equip those who walk beside them, and evangelize the lost with the hope of Jesus Christ. To partner with our ministry or to make a donation in your loved one's honor, please visit hopeinthemorning.org. Your donation helps keep these stories of hope on the air and helps tangibly meet the needs of the hurting.